Local news? Smoking ban [Archive] - San Mateo Daily Journal

2smart4u

11-21-2006, 11:16 AM

Anyone else find it odd that half the country reads and writes to the SMDJ?
Let's pick apart today's letters...

Robert Moon of Texas says that the "smoking ban in Belmont is the biggest restriction of freedom in the United States". But he fails to explain his ridiculous comment.

Then he says "next it will be against the law to pray in public". Well, no, praying doesn't hurt anyone.

He falls back on the same classicly ignorant arguments of the gun nuts. Comparing items that are useful and sometimes cause death (cars, knives, power tools, hammers) when used improperly or carelessly, to items that cause death and serve no useful purpose (cigarettes, guns).

Now, I would bet if you walked down the street waving a knife or hammer, weilding a turned-on power tool, or shooting a gun, you would get arrested. Cigarettes have not been banned. Smoking them in public has been.

He says we should ban "alcoholic beverages except wine". Well, while alcohol has no useful purpose, we've tried that before and it didn't work. And why the exception for wine?

He wants government to butt out? So I assume he's pro-choice and pro-gay marriage?

Karl in WA makes a foolish statement about pizza and pasta eaters, and beer drinkers causing a burden on the rest of society with health costs. Does he not realize the health costs the smokers burden society with? And not only do they make themselves ill, they sicken those around them. Come up with something better next time, Karl.

Anna in San Diego thinks that cigarette smokers do nothing to interfere with other people, mind their own business and hurt no one but themselves. WOW, is she misinformed!!! Maybe she should read some medical journals before voicing her opinions. She goes on about a bunch of totally unrelated things, before ending with, "Belmont, you disgust me." Well, Anna, and your fellow smokers, you disgust us. Shame that a nice city like San Diego has to have people like you in it.

Karyn in VA uses the same lame arguments about banning other things that make individuals possibly ill, but as with the other smokers, she ignores the fact that these things do not harm anyone but those individuals themselves. And yes, they certainly should make you smokers pay more for health insurance. Wow, what a whackjob.

And the guy in Peoria is waiting for the neighbor who calls the police because his neighbor is inside his own house smoking but happens to have his bathroom exhaust fan on allowing the neighbor to smell the smoke.

I can't wait for that to happen.

StanLee

11-22-2006, 04:13 PM

"Anyone else find it odd that half the country reads and writes to the SMDJ?"

No.

ladyteal

11-22-2006, 07:24 PM

Anyone else find it odd that half the country reads and writes to the SMDJ?....
Only You!

Let's pick apart today's letters

Robert Moon of Texas says that the "smoking ban in Belmont is the biggest restriction of freedom in the United States". But he fails to explain his ridiculous comment.?
He's quite correct, and the majority of people need no explanation.

Then he says "next it will be against the law to pray in public". Well, no, praying doesn't hurt anyone?
Apparently praying does hurt some people. It has been banned from quite a few public places.

He falls back on the same classicly ignorant arguments of the gun nuts. Comparing items that are useful and sometimes cause death (cars, knives, power tools, hammers) when used improperly or carelessly, to items that cause death and serve no useful purpose (cigarettes, guns)..?
50 million people find cigs useful, and probably quadruple that find guns useful.
A cig would be useful to blow smoke in your face. As to guns, use your imagination.

Now, I would bet if you walked down the street waving a knife or hammer, weilding a turned-on power tool, or shooting a gun, you would get arrested. Cigarettes have not been banned. Smoking them in public has been.
I would bet if cigs were banned in public, and you walk down the street with one, you would also be arrested. ROFLMAO

He says we should ban "alcoholic beverages except wine". Well, while alcohol has no useful purpose, we've tried that before and it didn't work. And why the exception for wine?.
2dumb4u thinks that it won't happen with tobacco? Black Market here we come! It's already happening in Canada.

He wants government to butt out? So I assume he's pro-choice and pro-gay marriage?
It's people like you that don't mind killing an unborn child, and then have the nerve to accuse smokers of causing illnesses. Hypocrit!

Karl in WA makes a foolish statement about pizza and pasta eaters, and beer drinkers causing a burden on the rest of society with health costs. Does he not realize the health costs the smokers burden society with? And not only do they make themselves ill, they sicken those around them. Come up with something better next time, Karl.
Obesity causes, according to the MSM that you so feverently espouse, 400,000 deaths yearly. According to the same MSM, 400,000 deaths a year are caused by smoking. What a kwinkydink.

Anna in San Diego thinks that cigarette smokers do nothing to interfere with other people, mind their own business and hurt no one but themselves. WOW, is she misinformed!!! Maybe she should read some medical journals before voicing her opinions. She goes on about a bunch of totally unrelated things, before ending with, "Belmont, you disgust me." Well, Anna, and your fellow smokers, you disgust us. Shame that a nice city like San Diego has to have people like you in it.
Isn't it funny that millions & millions of baby boomers grew up in households with at least one smoker, and they're still living! Parents even smoked in cars with the kids. It's truly amazing that any of us have survived! By the way when you say "US", who are you talking about? As far as I can see there is only one other person posting here that agrees with you.

Karyn in VA uses the same lame arguments about banning other things that make individuals possibly ill, but as with the other smokers, she ignores the fact that these things do not harm anyone but those individuals themselves. And yes, they certainly should make you smokers pay more for health insurance. Wow, what a whackjob.
How many non smokers do you know, that have simply gone to bed at night and died? That they never used their medical insurance? I would be willing to bet a year's salary that you don't know any. And of course, according to all of you anti smokers, smokers die younger. Therefore, we don't live long enough to use a lot of health insurance. By the way, you might want to tell my 82 year old smoking Mother that she is going to die prematurely. ROFLMAO
:D :D :D :D

Colonist

11-25-2006, 05:29 AM

http://www.garoweonline.com/stories/publish/article_5995.shtml

It's so refreshing to see Belmont's city council going down the same path as Somalia.:(
Sharia law in Belmont

Somalia

Somalia:Islamist cops nab 22 in raid on smokers
14 Nov 14, 2006, 18:15

Kismayo - Islamic religious police on Tuesday arrested 22 people for smoking in the Somali port of Kismayo, where they will be flogged if found guilty of violating a new tobacco ban, officials said.

Those detained were nabbed just days after local Islamist officials announced a total ban on the use of tobacco in the key southern port, in a new sign of their increasingly strict application of Sharia law.

"We started raids against tobacco users and we have arrested 22 people so far," Kismayo police deputy chief Mohmaed Abdulkadir Jibril told reporters here, about 500km south of the capital Mogadishu.

"Some of them were smoking cigarettes while others were using tobacco leaves when they were caught," he said.

The anti-smoking raids are the latest indication that Somalia's powerful Islamist movement, which is now girding for war with the weak government, is intent on imposing a fundamentalist version of Koranic law in its territory.

The Islamists, who seized Mogadishu in June and now control most of southern and central Somalia, have enacted Sharia in varying degrees but have banned live music and shuttered cinema halls and photo shops in most areas.

Elements of the movement are accused of links with al-Qaeda and their rise has fuelled fears of a takeover similar to that of the Taliban in Afghanistan who harboured Osama bin Laden and his terrorist network.

The Islamists deny those charges.

Public reaction to the tobacco and khat ban was mixed in Kismayo, a freewheeling port town that the Islamists seized in late September from a government-allied militia.

"It is the start of clean days in Kismayo because our children will have brighter future, free from drugs and other bad hobbies that threaten their lives," said businessman Haji Mohamed Mao.

But others denounced the move as a violation of their freedom of choice.

"I have been smoking for 18 years and no government has ever interfered with my cigarettes," said Abdulahi Ali Jumaa, a 37-year-old smoker who has yet to run afoul of the religious police.

"I think this move is derailing democracy in the region."

Sources:AFP

2smart4u

11-27-2006, 10:53 AM

"He's quite correct, and the majority of people need no explanation."

He's quite wrong, and failed to explain his ignorant comment.

"Apparently praying does hurt some people. It has been banned from quite a few public places."

Such as...? And please show me where it ever hurt anyone.

"50 million people find cigs useful, and probably quadruple that find guns useful.
A cig would be useful to blow smoke in your face. As to guns, use your imagination."

Wow, you are the typical smoker. Rude, ignorant, and abusive.

"I would bet if cigs were banned in public, and you walk down the street with one, you would also be arrested. ROFLMAO"

Um, yeah. But I would bever do that. Your point?

"2dumb4u thinks that it won't happen with tobacco? Black Market here we come! It's already happening in Canada."

Newsflash. Cigarettes haven't been banned anywhere in the US. Your point?

"It's people like you that don't mind killing an unborn child, and then have the nerve to accuse smokers of causing illnesses. Hypocrit!"

First of all, learn to spell. Secondly, how does one kill something that is "unborn"? Thirdly, you want to save babies so you can kill them with your smoke? Talk about a hypocrite! Just like the idiot I was referring to.

"Obesity causes, according to the MSM that you so feverently espouse, 400,000 deaths yearly. According to the same MSM, 400,000 deaths a year are caused by smoking. What a kwinkydink.[/B]

Yes, he is, and so are you. What was your point? If I was obese, would you be in any danger of standing next to me? If you smoke next to me, I AM in danger.

"Isn't it funny that millions & millions of baby boomers grew up in households with at least one smoker, and they're still living! Parents even smoked in cars with the kids. It's truly amazing that any of us have survived! By the way when you say "US", who are you talking about? As far as I can see there is only one other person posting here that agrees with you."

At least there is one other person here with common sense. "Us" refers to the people of the area with common sense. Those baby boomers parents are dead now, thank to the cigarettes they smoked. Some of their children developed breathing problems or died, too.

"How many non smokers do you know, that have simply gone to bed at night and died?"

Many.

"That they never used their medical insurance?"

Huh?

I would be willing to bet a year's salary that you don't know any."

You lose. Pay up.

" And of course, according to all of you anti smokers, smokers die younger. Therefore, we don't live long enough to use a lot of health insurance. By the way, you might want to tell my 82 year old smoking Mother that she is going to die prematurely. ROFLMAO[/B]
:D :D :D :D"

I will. What is her email address?

ladyteal

11-28-2006, 03:37 PM

but the idiot 2dumb4u is just sooooooooo easy.:p

"He's quite correct, and the majority of people need no explanation."
He's quite wrong, and failed to explain his ignorant comment.

He’s quite right, and you have no reading comprehension skills. All points made that you do not have the mental skills to refute, are answered by yourself as “ignorant”.

"Apparently praying does hurt some people. It has been banned from quite a few public places."

Such as...? And please show me where it ever hurt anyone.

In 2002, a three-judge panel of the 4th U.S. Circuit Court of Appeals ruled that mealtime prayers at the Virginia Military Institute (a state-funded military college) violated the constitutional separation of church and state.
On November 30th 2005, US District Judge David Hamilton ordered the Indiana Speaker of the House, Brian Bosma to instruct all clergy and individuals addressing the House not to invoke the name of Jesus Christ or make any other "denominational appeal." This decision was brought forth by a lawsuit dubbed, "Hinrichs v. Bosma." Judge Hamilton ruled that using the name of Jesus Christ is unconstitutional under the First Amendment. The lawsuit was brought by the Indiana Civil Liberties Union.
Louisiana school board can't open sessions with prayer
Federal judge says that as integral parts of school systems, boards are barred from endorsing particular religious beliefs. 02.28.05

ACLU wants school officials jailed for flouting prayer ban
For fourth time in less than two months, group notifies federal judge that teachers, administrators in Louisiana parish have violated court settlement. 05.20.05

Federal judge: Louisiana teacher didn't violate prayer ban
Court says teacher's Bible club, other activities weren't expressly prohibited by lawsuit settlement between Tangipahoa Parish, ACLU. 07.20.05

La. school board held in contempt for violating prayer ban
Federal judge finds prayers offered by students at two school banquets breached 2004 agreement between ACLU, Tangipahoa officials. 07.02.06

ACLU: Deal reached in student teacher's suit over school prayer
Cynthia Thompson sued Tangipahoa Parish School Board, Southeastern Louisiana University, saying she entered 'nightmare' of constant prayer, proselytizing in fourth-grade class. 10.04.06

Public School
Pre-game Prayer Creates Violence
Faith based terrorist tactics used by the religious right make
it a necessity for maintaining a strong separation of church and state
No one in the United States should suffer because they have different religious beliefs or no religious beliefs at all.
Unchecked terrorist tactics used by the religious right make it a necessity for maintaining a strong separation of State and Church.
A government that will demand its people to believe "the word of God" and respect "public prayer" is tyrannical.
My name is Bill Jager and this is a
background of my non-religious beliefs

NAVY CHAPLAIN PROTESTS PRAYER BAN
Friday, December 23, 2005 - FreeMarketNews.com

The holiday season has brought an unusual number of conflicts with it this year. Most of them center around efforts to either augment or eliminate the relationship between its religious significance and its commercial one, and the effect of this has even extended to the military. Navy Chaplain Gordon James Klingenschmitt, disgusted with the attempts to remove all signs of Christianity from Christmas, wanted to pray "in the name of Jesus" before his troops, but was not only denied this, but was stripped of his uniform and told he could only do so outside of his role as chaplain, and when dressed in civilian clothes.

As a result, according to a story at persuade.tv, Klingenschmitt has begun a hunger strike to protest the decision. He is asking President Bush to issue an Executive Order to allow military chaplains to pray according to their individual faith traditions. He has now been joined in the fasting by Rev. Patrick J. Mahoney, Director of the Christian Defense Coalition.
These are just few of the thousands you can find on the internet.

"50 million people find cigs useful, and probably quadruple that find guns useful.
A cig would be useful to blow smoke in your face. As to guns, use your imagination."

Wow, you are the typical smoker. Rude, ignorant, and abusive.

And you child are the emblematic anti-smoker; ill-informed, uncouth, unsophisticated and coarse. Notice I said anti-smoking, and not non-smoking. There is Big, Big difference between the two, and the majority of non-smokers are not anti-smoking.

"It's people like you that don't mind killing an unborn child, and then have the nerve to accuse smokers of causing illnesses. Hypocrit!"
First of all, learn to spell. Secondly, how does one kill something that is "unborn"? Thirdly, you want to save babies so you can kill them with your smoke? Talk about a hypocrite! Just like the idiot I was referring to.

When one cannot refute an argument, they resort to pointing out typos. Unborn does not mean NOT ALIVE. Ultrasonography can show the fetus's beating heart at 6 weeks of pregnancy and thus can confirm that the fetus is alive.

"I would bet if cigs were banned in public, and you walk down the street with one, you would also be arrested. ROFLMAO"

Um, yeah. But I would bever do that. Your point?

The point was missed by you because you lack reading comprehension skills.

"Obesity causes, according to the MSM that you so feverently espouse, 400,000 deaths yearly. According to the same MSM, 400,000 deaths a year are caused by smoking. What a kwinkydink.

Yes, he is, and so are you. What was your point? If I was obese, would you be in any danger of standing next to me? If you smoke next to me, I AM in danger.

Yes, he is???? Who is he??? What are you talking about. Apparently you do not know what MSM means.

If I’m smoking, just stay away. Anyway, again, you missed the point. So obtuse!

"Isn't it funny that millions & millions of baby boomers grew up in households with at least one smoker, and they're still living! Parents even smoked in cars with the kids. It's truly amazing that any of us have survived! By the way when you say "US", who are you talking about? As far as I can see there is only one other person posting here that agrees with you."

At least there is one other person here with common sense. "Us" refers to the people of the area with common sense. Those baby boomers parents are dead now, thank to the cigarettes they smoked. Some of their children developed breathing problems or died, too.

I’m a baby boomer, and my parents are alive and well. Including my 82 year old smoking Mom. I have no breathing problems, and I’m still alive at age 61. What say you now?

"How many non smokers do you know, that have simply gone to bed at night and died?"
Many.

"That they never used their medical insurance?"

Huh?

I would be willing to bet a year's salary that you don't know any."

You lose. Pay up.

" And of course, according to all of you anti smokers, smokers die younger. Therefore, we don't live long enough to use a lot of health insurance. By the way, you might want to tell my 82 year old smoking Mother that she is going to die prematurely. ROFLMAO
"

I will. What is her email address?

Why don’t I believe you? I’m sure most people reading this post don’t believe you either.
My Mother doesn’t have email. All she does on the computer is play Canasta & Pinochle while she’s smoking.
You Lose. Now go play, and quit annoying the adults. Children should be seen and not heard.
:confused: :D ;)

2smart4u

11-28-2006, 04:34 PM

2smart4u

11-28-2006, 04:36 PM

Teal, all you do is prove how accurate my screen name is.
Come back and post after you get an education.

2smart4u

11-28-2006, 04:52 PM

"my 82 year old smoking Mom"

Does that 82 years include the 9 months or so while your grandmother carried her?

"I’m still alive at age 61"

Does that include the 9 months or so your mother carried you?

You're just a bitter old lady. You don't want the Government telling you not to breathe smoke into other people's faces, but you want them to tell women what they can do with their own bodies. Real nice.

Dimomma

11-29-2006, 08:53 AM

The true crux of this prohibition is the relenquishment of personal rights through government control. What I'd really like to see is government being totally accountable for the financial controls over where my tax dollars are spent. One town banning smoking is not at the top of my list of good government accountability. It seems to be a personal moral/ethical debate with those in positions of power.

As with other laws this nation seems to be making, a select few are getting to decide the fate of the masses. When government gets to decide that my personal vehicle, paid for by my personal earnings and tax dollars and insured by me, can be molested by laws enacted by a puritanical few, then I need to be compensated for my loss of personal use. I abide by the laws of the road when it comes to endangering others, i.e. speeding, running red lights, safety belts and maintaining insurance. But if I'm smoking in my car because of my own stupidity and addiction, what makes you think you have the right to tell me what to do in my own personal setting? Or is my car now going to be owned by government? Ticket me for throwing out a cigarette butt akin to littering, but government has no involvement in my personal choices that affect no one but me.

ladyteal

11-29-2006, 10:47 AM

No, you lose. You are the quintessential loser. Get off of your mommy's computer, little boy.

He's quite wrong, as are you. You have no reading comprehension skills nor debating skills.
I repeat: He’s quite right, and you have no reading comprehension skills. All points made that you do not have the mental skills to refute, are answered by yourself as “ignorant”.

I'm still waiting for you to show me where prayer has ever hurt anyone.
Please listen carefully, as an attempt is made to draw pictures for this reading impaired person:
Scores of non-religious people claim that hearing prayer or seeing religious symbols on public property causes them undue stress, and emotional duress; thereby hurting them, at least mentally. Of course, most of us know that prayer never really hurt anybody. But with the help of the ACLU, many lawsuits have been filed claiming that prayer hurts. If this sounds vaguely familiar, it is. The rabid anti-smokers are doing the same thing with smoking.

Not one person in the world finds cigarettes useful, because they are not useful. You are ignorant beyond words.
I beg to differ. 50 million USA smokers find them very useful, if only to blow smoke in YOUR face.

It's a fetus, not a living human being. It could not survive outside of the womb. You are a hypocrite.
If the heart is beating, it’s a living entity. Nothing you or anyone else says can change that fact. It can continue to live inside the womb, and continue to grow. However, if you choose to abort it before it has a chance to fully develop; it is murder, pure & simple. My belief is that a woman can do anything with her body that she wants to do, to include smoking or abortion. Do I believe that abortion is right? No, I do not condone abortion. Would I tell a woman that you can’t have an abortion? No I would not. Would I tell someone they can’t smoke? No, I would not. The only hypocrite is 2dumb4u.

There was no point made by you because you lack communication skills.
Original point that 2dumb4u tried to make: Now, I would bet if you walked down the street waving a knife or hammer, weilding a turned-on power tool, or shooting a gun, you would get arrested. Cigarettes have not been banned. Smoking them in public has been.
If one is walking down the street smoking, and smoking has been banned in public, what exactly does
2dumb4u think will happen? Is the street not public?????
I just can’t resist this one, sorry all: i before e, except after c

"Obesity causes, according to the MSM that you so feverently espouse, 400,000 deaths yearly. According to the same MSM, 400,000 deaths a year are caused by smoking. What a kwinkydink.Yes, he is, and so are you. What was your point? If I was obese, would you be in any danger of standing next to me? If you smoke next to me, I AM in danger.
You didn't make a point. You can't even explain what your point was. LOL
Lies, lies and damned lies! Lies told by the antis: Anti-Smoking & Anti-Fat Lies. 400,000 dead from smoking according to MSM. 400,000 dead from obesity according to MSM. Kwinkydink? No, just more lies.
If you, or anyone else, is obese, and stands next to me it will cause me to gag uncontrollably. It will cause me great emotional stress, and might in turn cause me to have a heart attack. Besides, obese people have this weird odor about them. Like the dirt can’t get out from behind all the fat folds on their bodies.

You should pour water on your mother if she is smoking. All I can say is how truly ignorant you and your mother are.
That statement by you tells everyone reading it that you are a bigot. You don’t know anything about my Mother, except that she smokes, and you have the nerve to call HER ignorant. Crawl back under the rock you came from.

No, you lose. You are the quintessential loser. Get off of your mommy's computer, little boy.

POINT: Ladyteal

MATCH: Ladyteal

GAME: Ladyteal

And game is now over. 2dumb4u and the incessant use of the word “ignorant” to refute points, thoroughly disgusts me. Just know this 2dumb4u, if I ever meet you somewhere, or even if I meet someone that I THINK could be you; no matter where I am, or what I am doing, a cigarette will be lit, and smoke blown in your face. You truly deserve it.

I am done with this TROLL.

jonvn

11-29-2006, 10:52 AM

The true crux of this prohibition is the relenquishment of personal rights through government control.

It's not really personal rights. Because other people have a right to not have to smell or inhale your smoke.

These are competing interests. And the government needs to and does fall on the side of the general public health.

You don't have a right to make others physically ill or uncomfortable with a noxious fume.

So it's not a rights issue.

Dimomma

11-29-2006, 11:02 AM

It is a personal right to be able to smoke in my own car. However, I do not smoke with another person in my vehicle and I don't smoke around others, especially children. I have a habit. I'm addicted to nicotine. You don't have the right to tell me I can't smoke in my own vehicle. Period.

2smart4u

11-29-2006, 01:06 PM

"I repeat: He’s quite right"

You can repeat it all you want. He's still wrong, and you just keeping making a fool of yourself.

"Please listen carefully, as an attempt is made to draw pictures for this reading impaired person:
Scores of non-religious people claim that hearing prayer or seeing religious symbols on public property causes them undue stress, and emotional duress; thereby hurting them, at least mentally. Of course, most of us know that prayer never really hurt anybody. But with the help of the ACLU, many lawsuits have been filed claiming that prayer hurts. If this sounds vaguely familiar, it is. The rabid anti-smokers are doing the same thing with smoking."

I've never heard of anyone claiming to have been hurt by prayer. The thing about smoking is that it DOES hurt others.

"I beg to differ. 50 million USA smokers find them very useful, if only to blow smoke in YOUR face."

Which is EXACTLY why they need to be banned.

"If the heart is beating, it’s a living entity."

Lots of things are living entities. You wouldn't be able to survive without killing some of them.

"However, if you choose to abort it before it has a chance to fully develop; it is murder, pure & simple."

Not at all. It is abortion. You can't murder what hasn't been born, and couldn't survive on its own. You are a hypocrite.

"If one is walking down the street smoking, and smoking has been banned in public, what exactly does
2dumb4u think will happen?"

Hopefully, you will get arrested. Your point?

"Lies, lies and damned lies! Lies told by the antis: Anti-Smoking & Anti-Fat Lies. 400,000 dead from smoking according to MSM. 400,000 dead from obesity according to MSM. Kwinkydink? No, just more lies."

From you, yes.

"If you, or anyone else, is obese, and stands next to me it will cause me to gag uncontrollably. It will cause me great emotional stress, and might in turn cause me to have a heart attack. "

Sounds like a personal problem to me.

"Besides, obese people have this weird odor about them."

Like smokers, you mean?

" You don’t know anything about my Mother, except that she smokes, and you have the nerve to call HER ignorant. Crawl back under the rock you came from."

She smokes, does she not? She gave birth to you, did she not? I rest my case.

" Just know this 2dumb4u, if I ever meet you somewhere, or even if I meet someone that I THINK could be you; no matter where I am, or what I am doing, a cigarette will be lit, and smoke blown in your face. You truly deserve it."

And my your face will meet my foot.

"I am done with this TROLL."

Talking about your mother again?

2smart4u

11-29-2006, 01:08 PM

Hey, manteal... It's Game, Point, Match. Not Point, Match, Game. Your ignorance is showing again.

2smart4u

11-29-2006, 02:55 PM

"but the idiot 2dumb4u"

"He’s quite right, and you have no reading comprehension skills."

"And you child are the emblematic anti-smoker; ill-informed, uncouth, unsophisticated and coarse. "

When one cannot refute an argument, they resort to insults.

It continues...

"The point was missed by you because you lack reading comprehension skills."

"Now go play, and quit annoying the adults. Children should be seen and not heard."

Liars tend to not trust others.

"Why don’t I believe you?"

2smart4u

11-29-2006, 03:05 PM

And it continues:

"you have no reading comprehension skills."

"Please listen carefully, as an attempt is made to draw pictures for this reading impaired person"

"2dumb4u"

They also get abusive when they are are the losing end of a debate:

"50 million USA smokers find them very useful, if only to blow smoke in YOUR face."

Again, with the liar not believing anyone else:

"Lies, lies and damned lies! Lies told by the antis: just more lies."

More insults, but this directed at others:

"If you, or anyone else, is obese, and stands next to me it will cause me to gag uncontrollably. It will cause me great emotional stress, and might in turn cause me to have a heart attack. Besides, obese people have this weird odor about them. Like the dirt can’t get out from behind all the fat folds on their bodies."

Reduced to childish taunts...

"Crawl back under the rock you came from."

And a threat:

"Just know this 2dumb4u, if I ever meet you somewhere, or even if I meet someone that I THINK could be you; no matter where I am, or what I am doing, a cigarette will be lit, and smoke blown in your face."

Followed by one last insult:

"I am done with this TROLL."

Yep, some intelligence and debating skills you got there, granma.
You're making your side look worse every time you post.

jamison

11-29-2006, 03:25 PM

I'm not a smoker. If I ever met up with this person 2smart4u, if I could find a cigarette I'd light one and blow smoke in its face too, just for you Ladyteal. You are quite right calling 2s4u the name 2dumb4u.
Jamison

2smart4u

11-29-2006, 03:42 PM

jamison

11-29-2006, 06:44 PM

And I would spit in your face, jammedassson.

And I would have you arrested for assault and battery. You'd give me a heart attack worrying about getting aids. Bahwawawawawa

Jamison

2smart4u

11-30-2006, 09:53 AM

And I would have you arrested for assault and battery. You'd give me a heart attack worrying about getting aids. Bahwawawawawa

Jamison

Self-defense. You'd be the one arrested. Does your mother have aids? She said she didn't. You are such a child.

jamison

11-30-2006, 12:29 PM

Self-defense. You'd be the one arrested. Does your mother have aids? She said she didn't. You are such a child.

Oh, come on! Did I insult your mother? What is with you and the insults to peoples's moms? Or do you just want to start one of those "Yo Momma is so...." tirades? You say I'm such a child? 2s4u needs to look in the mirror to discover who the child (read brat) really is.

Jamison

2smart4u

11-30-2006, 12:42 PM

Oh, come on! Did I insult your mother? What is with you and the insults to peoples's moms? Or do you just want to start one of those "Yo Momma is so...." tirades? You say I'm such a child? 2s4u needs to look in the mirror to discover who the child (read brat) really is.

Jamison

Excuse me, but who is the one who has not added anything intelligent to the conversation, and in fact has not even really even referred to the topic, but has tossed around insults and made childish "jokes", which only they were amused by? For the answer, look in the mirror, little girl.

Did I insult your mother? I only said that she told me she didn't have AIDS.

Come back when you grow up or grow a brain.

jamison

11-30-2006, 12:49 PM

Excuse me, but who is the one who has not added anything intelligent to the conversation, and in fact has not even really even referred to the topic, but has tossed around insults and made childish "jokes", which only they were amused by? For the answer, look in the mirror, little girl.

Did I insult your mother? I only said that she told me she didn't have AIDS.

Come back when you grow up or grow a brain.

I don't get it! Did I at anytime bring up your mother? No! So why insult my mother? Nobody posting on any of the topics in this forum has said anything about your mother. So why insult their mothers?
People, 2s4u is one sick puppy. I suggest we avoid 2s4u like the plague. I know I'm going to.
Jamison

2smart4u

11-30-2006, 12:54 PM

I don't get it! Did I at anytime bring up your mother? No! So why insult my mother? Nobody posting on any of the topics in this forum has said anything about your mother. So why insult their mothers?
People, 2s4u is one sick puppy. I suggest we avoid 2s4u like the plague. I know I'm going to.
Jamison

What's not to get? You have yet to post ANYTHING about the topic. All you have is insults. You are one childish, ignorant, little puke.

If you avoid me, you'll have to find someone else to try and insult. You were failing miserably with me, anyway.

I've got an idea! Try finding a topic you know something about, and post in that thread!

happysmoker

11-30-2006, 04:06 PM

People, 2s4u is one sick puppy.

2s4u also has the IQ of a rock and demonstrates it with every post...but that's neither here nor there. He's paid by the antis to post their garbage and lies and to distract and redirect from the topic at hand, using insults and stupid remarks.

Ladyteal nailed it--he's a troll. And you're right, Jamison, best to ignore him.

2smart4u

11-30-2006, 04:27 PM

jamison

11-30-2006, 05:24 PM

2s4u also has the IQ of a rock and demonstrates it with every post...but that's neither here nor there. He's paid by the antis to post their garbage and lies and to distract and redirect from the topic at hand, using insults and stupid remarks.

Ladyteal nailed it--he's a troll. And you're right, Jamison, best to ignore him.
Ladyteal nailed quite a few things about the troll.
Like I said before, I don't smoke. I own a small business that is my livelihood. If smoking bans go into effect, I'm afraid that my business will go under. I have several friends in CA that own the same type of business that I do. 2 of these friends lost their business within one year of a smoking ban in their communites. One of them owned the business for 28 years. 3 other friends are not far from losing theirs. Fact is, and all you have to do is use the internet for facts, when smokers are banned from places, they don't go there. Their motto has become, so to speak, "hit them where it hurts, and that's their pocketbooks." Guess what, they do and it hurts. It hurts the small businesses, the staple of our country. I've found out also that a lot of smokers no longer purchase cigarettes from big tobacco. They buy organics, or loose tobacco and roll their own-RYO. This will eventually trickle down to all taxpayers, as governments keep losing more and more tax money from smokers. Less tobacco money in the coffers, the more taxes every citizen will have to pay to make up for it. What I don't understand is why are the big anti-tobacco people so adamant that businesses can't choose to be non-smoking, smoking, or accomodate both smoking and non-smoking? What are they afraid of?
Jamison

happysmoker

11-30-2006, 09:40 PM

What are they afraid of?

They are afraid that you and others like you will research and learn the facts: that the "dangers of secondhand smoke" is a scam and a fraud, a money-making scheme for the heads of the anti-smoking groups, such as ASH, and the pharmaceutical companies, such as Johnson & Johnson who make Nicoderm. They are afraid that you will take what you learn and beat back these smoking bans, using real science, not the junk science they use.

I'm still fairly new to all of this, but visit these links to learn the facts and seek help in how to stop the ban:

http://www.forces.org
http://www.smokersclubinc.com
http://www.antibrains.com
http://www.thetruthisalie.com
http://www.davehitt.com/facts/index.html
http://www.lcolby.com
http://legacy.library.ucsf.edu/cgi/getdoc?tid=isf14d00&fmt=pdf&ref=results

I hope you try to understand where smokers are coming from when they don't patronize establishments the same after a ban is in place as before. Part of it is to "hit them where it hurts" (and encourage hospitality businesses to fight the ban!), but part of it is "Why go where I'm not comfortable and accomodated?" Why should smokers go to establishments where they can't smoke, relax, and enjoy the company of friends? They can't enjoy the experience if they have to go outside every time they want to light up, so why not stay home or gather at a friend's house instead where they can smoke in comfort and safety.

Earlier this year, I switched from packaged cigarettes to rolling my own. Packaged cigarettes, like packaged food found in the supermarkets, have chemicals added. Pure tobacco, like fresh food, is better! I switched for that reason, for the cost savings (cut nearly in half), and so I wouldn't be paying--through exhorbitant taxes--into the MSA, filling the antis pockets, and paying for pet projects that no one else wants to pay for so they add another tax onto cigarettes.

2smart4u

12-01-2006, 10:07 AM

"Ladyteal nailed quite a few things about the troll."

Really, what did she say about you?

"Like I said before, I don't smoke. I own a small business that is my livelihood. If smoking bans go into effect, I'm afraid that my business will go under. I have several friends in CA that own the same type of business that I do. 2 of these friends lost their business within one year of a smoking ban in their communites. One of them owned the business for 28 years. 3 other friends are not far from losing theirs. Fact is, and all you have to do is use the internet for facts, when smokers are banned from places, they don't go there."

The few smokers that decide not to go there anymore are replaced by at least that many non-smokers.

"I've found out also that a lot of smokers no longer purchase cigarettes from big tobacco. They buy organics, or loose tobacco and roll their own-RYO. This will eventually trickle down to all taxpayers, as governments keep losing more and more tax money from smokers."

What, they don't collect taxes on the organics, loose tobacco, or papers? Not too bright, are you?

"What I don't understand is why are the big anti-tobacco people so adamant that businesses can't choose to be non-smoking, smoking, or accomodate both smoking and non-smoking? What are they afraid of?"

Having to breathe that crap, for one thing. You can't have a bar or restaurant both smoking and non-smoking. The smoke doesn't know to stay in the smoking area. The other customers and the employees don't want to breathe your pollution, and suffer the effects of breathing it. How hard is that to understand?

2smart4u

12-01-2006, 10:14 AM

"They are afraid that you and others like you will research and learn the facts: that the "dangers of secondhand smoke" is a scam and a fraud, a money-making scheme for the heads of the anti-smoking groups, such as ASH, and the pharmaceutical companies, such as Johnson & Johnson who make Nicoderm. They are afraid that you will take what you learn and beat back these smoking bans, using real science, not the junk science they use."

That is the most ignorant crap I have ever read!

Too bad you can't provide even one legitimate link to back it up!

Stop spreading your lies on behalf of Big Tobacco and Big Anti-Fresh Air!

" part of it is "Why go where I'm not comfortable and accomodated?" Why should smokers go to establishments where they can't smoke, relax, and enjoy the company of friends?"

Right. Why would non-smokers (a large majority) go to a place that allowed smoking? Why would they go where they couldn't enjoy breathable air?

jamison

12-01-2006, 12:24 PM

AAPlace City Name Business Closed? Bus. Lost Tips Lost / Jobs Lost HOME

AK Anchorage Oscar's Place Restaurant 40% 3 I opened my door 13 years ago to give the common man a place to go. Now 3 years after the do gooders passed the smoking ban, my business still hasn't recovered, and I may have to close my doors forever.
AR Fayetteville Cafe Santa Fe Restaurant Closed 100% 100%
AR Fayetteville Casa Taco Restaurant Closed 100% 100% "Sales dropped off dramatically. We lost our late-night business ... a lot of people come in after the bars close."
AR Fayetteville Hoffbrau Bar/Rest Closed 100% 100% Before closing, The Hoffbrau reported a 50% drop in liquor sales due to the ban.
AR Fayetteville Ozark Brewing Co Brew Pub Closed 100% 100%
AZ Tempe Crocodile Cafe Restaurant Closed 100% 100%
AZ Tempe Pooch's Easy Street Billiards Pool Hall Closed 100% 100%
CA Bell The Lika Club Tavern 60%
CA Clearlake Oaks Dunkhouse Saloon Tavern 50%
CA Escondido Fireside Lounge Tavern 70%
CA Lakewood Grand Central Casino Casino 42% 15 Since the ban took effect in February, liquor sales are down 42 percent and food sales have dropped 25 percent. Fifteen employees have been laid off and another 40 to 50 jobs are in jeopardy.
CA Lancaster Calico Saloon Tavern 30% 5
CA Long Beach Daddy's Lounge Tavern 35% 3
CA San Luis Obispo Laurel Bowl Bowling Alley Closed 100% 100% 385 league bowlers quit when the smoking ban went into effect, with a loss of $200,000. Laurel Bowl had been in business for 37 years before the ban.
CA Santa Fe Rim Ram Tavern 75-90% Before the smoking ban, we would take in about nine-hundred dollars on Wednesday nights. The week following the start of the smoking ban we barely made three-hundred dollars. The next week we only made seventy-five dollars, and we made even less in the weeks following,"
CA Soulsbyville The Old Dog House Tavern Closed 100% 100%
CA Tulare Doherty's Tavern 66%
CA Tulare Marco Polo Lounge Tavern 80% "On nights where we allow our patrons to smoke, we make about $120 a night. Last Monday we didn't allow our customers to smoke. Our total sales were five dollars."
CA Willow Femino's Blue Gum Restaurant Closed 100% 100%
CANADA Acton Red Dog Cafe Restaurant Closed 100% 100%
CANADA Ajax BB's Bar & Grill Restaurant/Bar Closed 100% 100%
CANADA Ajax Chatts Restaurant/Bar Closed 100% 100%
CANADA Ajax Harp & Hound Restaurant/Bar Closed 100% 100%
CANADA Ajax Puk & Beaver Restaurant/Bar Closed 100% 100%
CANADA Ajax Raven & Firkin Restaurant/Bar Closed 100% 100%
CANADA Ajax Sword and Stone Restaurant/Bar Closed 100% 100%
CANADA Ajax Taps Restaurant/Bar Closed 100% 100%
CANADA Ajax The Arctic Restaurant/Bar Closed 100% 100%
CANADA Ajax Thirsty Monk Restaurant/Bar Closed 100% 100%
CANADA Alberta All rest, bar, bingo 40% Consumer prices are going to go up for menu items, Lindy Rollingson, president and CEO of the Alberta Restaurant and Foodservices Association, said yesterday. "There just isn't anywhere else to move."
CANADA Barrie Coffee Time Coffee Shop 50% 100%
CANADA Cambridge Bud's Place Tavern 23% 5
CANADA Castlegar Gardeli's Bar/Restaurant Closed 100% 100%
CANADA Chamberlain Ralph's Place Restaurant/ Diner 75% Jackie Bradley, Owner says, “There is no future here.”
CANADA Chatham Eightball VIP Sports Cafe Sports Bar 40% 2
CANADA Crescentwood Tubbys Pizza Pizza Parlor 20% 2
CANADA Dunnville nastys Sports Bar 37%
CANADA Edmonton Bingo Halls Charity 50% In the first 6 months of the ban.
CANADA Edmonton Epcor Café & Deli Café Closed 100% 100% "The place used to be packed with smokers every morning until the bylaw came in."
CANADA Edmonton Jimmy Ray's Sports Bar & Lounge Bar Closed 100% Business had been down 30 to 35 per-cent each month
CANADA Edmonton Pucks at Coliseum Inn Bar 18 jobs The bar is now closed on Monday and Tuesday nights.
CANADA Edmonton Sherlock Holmes Pub and The Rose & Crown Pub Bars 40% Manager Pat Tarbox reported loss. Tarbox's hubby butts up against smoke ban. It's hurting his bar business says man who was married to anti-smoking crusader.
CANADA Edmonton The Moose Factory Restaurant 35% Tom Goodchild said it's devastating, and had to lay off employees.
CANADA Fort St. John Alexander Mackenzie Inn Hotel 92% 16 "Since we were `beaten' into compliance by the WCB, our business has dropped in the lounge from $1,000 a day to $80. "
CANADA Gander Father's Place 40% My business is down 40 per cent and everyone's in the same boat. I haven't come across one person who hasn't lost revenue, so we have to do something. This is important to everyone right across the province.
CANADA Goose Bay Happy Valley Nightclub Closed 100% After the smoking ban, it was like somebody turned on a light. It was just nobody there – absolutely nobody, said Lethbridge.
CANADA Inuvik Inuvik Curling Club Private Club 66% The president of Inuvik's Curling Club predicts it will lose $40,000 by the end of the year, and says the town's smoking by-law is to blame.
CANADA Johnstown Bingo International 43 Charities Closed 100% Goodwin said the final straw was the province wide smoking ban.
CANADA Kingston Larry's Pit Stop Tavern 49% 1
CANADA Kitchener Mingles Coffee Shoppe Coffee Shop Closed 100% 100% Before Closing, Mingles saw a 45% drop in sales.
CANADA Markham Coffee Time Coffee Shop Closed 100% 100%
CANADA Midland Cellarman's Alehouse Tavern 35% Friday nights used to generate $2,400-$3,100 before the smoking ban. Since the ban those numbers dropped to $900-$1,400.
CANADA New Brunswick Various Places 24% Pubs and bars in New Brunswick suffered a 24% drop in liquor sales in the first month of a ban similar to the one passed in Ontario.
CANADA Country Various Places various www. pubcoalition. com/ Bars and pubs sales were reduced: 23.5% in Ottawa, 18.7% in London, 24.3% in Kingston and 20.4% in Kitchener.

jamison

12-01-2006, 12:25 PM

CANADA Ontario Various Places 25% Sales at the average Ontario pub, bar and nightclub have fallen by 25% and 4,100 jobs have been lost in this sector.
CANADA Ontario Tourist Spending 7%
CANADA Oshawa Flying Squirrel Restaurant/Bar Closed 100% 100%
CANADA Oshawa Konfusions Restaurant/Bar Closed 100% 100%
CANADA Oshawa Micky Finns Restaurant/Bar Closed 100% 100%
CANADA Oshawa Queen's Hotel Restaurant/Bar Closed 100% 100%
CANADA Oshawa The Castle Restaurant/Bar Closed 100% 100%
CANADA Oshawa The Wall Restaurant/Bar Closed 100% 100%
CANADA Oshawa Winchester Arms (2 locations) Restaurant/Bar Closed 100% 100%
CANADA Ottawa Beacon Hill Arms Tavern Closed 100% 100% Dave O'Connor, who successfully ran Ottawa's Beacon Hill Arms pub for nine years, said the ban forced him out of business. "From September to February, we lost close to $80,000 in sales"
CANADA Ottawa Hemingway's Bar/Restaraunt 40% 6
CANADA Ottawa Sky Garden Restaurant Closed 100% 100% / 6 "It was 100% because of the bylaw. Sales dropped 50%. Our cups of coffee were down 400 to 500 a day, our meals 20 to 30 a day."
CANADA Owen Sound Beach Brothers Bar Closed 100% 100% There were only 3 bars in a city with almost 22,000, with a small college. This makes the count of bars at 2, with this historical building being built and used since 1887 as a hotel.
CANADA Pickering Melanie Pringles Restaurant/Bar Closed 100% 100%
CANADA Polo Park Branigan's Tavern Closed 100% 100% / 50
CANADA Prince Rupert Rupert Pub Tavern Closed 100% 100%
CANADA Portage la Prairie Royal Canadian Legion Branch No. 65 Club 30% “It’ll make a big hole in the community,” branch president Keith Hutchinson said.
CANADA Regina Casinos 33% To counter the impact of the ban, the gaming corporation increased advertising and hired more staff, resulting in a 14 per cent increase in expenses.
CANADA Riverton Sandy Bar Hotel Hotel Closed 100% 100% Rob Charrier said he was forced to close, had been open since 1947.
CANADA Saskatchewan Confederation Bingo Bingo Closed 100% I'm guessing they're sitting at home, having a cigarette at home and finding other forms of entertainment, said Randy Gudmundson.
CANADA Saskatoon Royal Canadian Legion Bar 50% He says even the non-smokers have stopped coming because they can't hang out with their smoking buddies.
CANADA St. Albert The Patch Tavern 70%
CANADA St. Thomas Burty Bob's Bar Closed 100% Daniels blamed inequitable enforcement of the city’s smoking ban.
CANADA Thunder Bay Empire Hotel Hotel 40% “I am doing the best that I can considering my limited space to work with to accommodate my customers and to help my business survive. It seems to me that our city council is not interested in supporting us in any way.”
CANADA Thunder Bay Kilroy's Sports Pub & Billiards 25% Strapped for cash, the business reduced its sponsorship of local sports teams, laid off staff and reduced business hours.
CANADA Thunder Bay Newfie's Pub Bar 20% “In my opinion, the city was very unfair in the first place to impose a 100 per cent no-smoking by-law without any concessions, options, or regard for the bar operators and our customers.”
CANADA Thunder Bay The Aurora Grill Bar & Grill Closed 100% 100% Doug Fraser and Cheryl Klause can’t compete with ban against Casino.
CANADA Thunder Bay Thunderbolts Swim Club Bingo Hall Closed 100% 100% Closed because of ban, no money now for the kids.
CANADA Tilsbury Mr. B's Restaurant Closed 41%
CANADA Tornoto Cobalt Tavern 50% "You build this business, and you're proud of it, and all of a sudden the city makes this blind decision...places like us get totally screwed."
CANADA Toronto Bovine Sex Club Tavern 50%
CANADA Toronto Elements Nightclub Closed 100% 100%
CANADA Toronto Elsewhere Bar & Grill Tavern 100% We cut staff early to save cost and boredom. The City of Toronto promised us a deluge of non-smokers who would be deliriously happy to visit us because we're non-smoking. Where are they?
CANADA Toronto Strathmore Bingo Bingo Hall Closed 100% 21 Closed for 2 months. "Net revenue in May was very low with each charity only receiving $45 per session they worked," said Mr. Brock. "This is compared to the (ore-ban) average of about $100 per session."
CANADA Toronto The Spotted Dick Taverm 60%
CANADA Vancover Bacchus Nightclub 100% 100% In its first two years, it regularly would close to its 275-person indoors capacity, Sorochan {the owner} says. As business dwindled, you'd be lucky to find 60 patrons on hand.
CANADA Wallaceburg Sam's Hotel Tavern 60-70 "(Business is down) probably 60-70 per cent (at night) and 90 per cent in the daytime."
CANADA Whitby Cannucksters Restaurant/Bar Closed 100% 100%
CANADA Whitby Chitchats Restaurant/Bar Closed 100% 100%
CANADA Whitby Otter and Firkin Restaurant/Bar Closed 100% 100%
CANADA Whitehorse Coffee Shop Coffee Shop Closed 100% 100% Owner sues over ban for 5.6 million.
CANADA Whitehourse The Coffee Bar Coffee Shop 50%
CANADA Winnipeg Happy Joe's Restaurant Closed 100% 100%
CANADA Yellowknife MacKenzie Lounge Tavern 80%
CO Greeley Red Garter Lounge Tavern 45%
CO Greeley Roasty's Steakhouse Restaraunt 60%
CO Greeley Union Colony Brewery Brew Pub Closed 100% 100%
CO Louisville Bart's Bar/Restaurant Closed 100% 100% Bart's had been in operation for nearly 30 years.
CO Pueblo Assorted Tavern Closed 100% "The smoking ban affected the bars in Pueblo quite drastically. We've had six to 10 bars close since the smoking ban started," said Chuck Chavez, owner of the Sunset Inn.
CO Pueblo Bruno's Beer Joynt Tavern Closed 100%
CO Pueblo Mugsy's Tavern Closed 100%
CO Pueblo Pepper's Tavern Closed 100%
CO Pueblo Silver Saddle Tavern Closed 100%
CO Pueblo Town Tavern Tavern Closed 100%
CT Bristol Tracie's Pub Tavern 40% My business has dropped about 30 to 40 percent since the smoking ban. I've spoken with a lot of bar owners in town and they all have the same problem.
CT Colchester Moriarty's Pub Closed 100% 100% After nearly two decades in business, Moriarty's Pub was done in by the ban on smoking, its owner said.
CT Cromwell Saw Mill Pub Restaurant Closed 100% 100%

jamison

12-01-2006, 12:26 PM

CT Fairfield Bear and Grill Bar/Restaurant 30-40% "I used to close down at 1 a.m. Now I close down at 9:30. The next three hours are dead."
CT Hartford A-Vend, Inc. Vending 60% Hurt by the trickle down effect of the ban.
CT Meriden La Primavera Restaurant Closed 100% When the statewide smoking ban snuffed out cigarettes in his bar area last October, 80 percent of his business went up in smoke. The restaurant was one of the few family restaurants remaining in the city.
CT Montville Brown Derby Tavern 50%
CT New London Nowhere Café Restaurant 80% Diane Batte-Holmgren said business will only get worse as winter draws closer.
CT New London Sundowner Restaurant Restaurant 30% 2 He's laid off two employees and is asking waiters to double up on shifts.
CT Norwich Pinstripes Sports Bar Closed 100% 100%
CT Norwich Pinstripes Sports Cafe Sports Bar Closed 100% 100%
CT Old Saybrook Adreanas Restaurant Restaurant Closed 100% 100%
CT Stamford Rack N' Roll Pool Hall 30%
CT Wallingford T-Bowl Lanes Bowling 50% 50% "Income cut in half, that's a big chunk of my business" says Carmen Izzi.
CT Waterbury Bobby D's Café Bar/Night Club 60% Our day business is mostly blue collar with many contractors and factory workers who come in after work. 90 percent of the customers in my bar smoke.
CT Windsor Locks Cargo's Café Restaurant Closed 100% 100%
DE Bear Just Mugs Saloon Tavern 33%
DE Wilmington Back Stage Cafe Bar/Restaurant Closed 100% 100% / 20
DE Wilmington Coach House Bar/Restaurant Closed 100% 100% / 8
DE Wilmington Naamans Cafe Restaurant Closed 100% 100% / 8
FL Cape Coral Collier Lee Vending Vending Machines 40% N/A We have over 60 customer accounts in 4 counties all of which have shown losses of 25% to 60% since the start of the ban.
FL Cutler Ridge Old Cutler Oyster Company Restaurant Closed 100% 100% Has been fighting the ban since it went into effect.
FL Fort Walton Elks #1795 (Private Club) Lodge Private Club 40% 22% "Charity money is down 45%. Our Charities are Kids of Florida and the Veterans. That is who is really getting hurt the most by this!"
FL Ft. Pierce Elks Private Club 50% (Bingo "Our Charity money is down 50% or more over this time last year. We are going to be able to spend only about $5,000.00 this year on our Christmas programs vs. $12,000.00 plus last year. The Christmas programs include Salvation Army, Waterfront Mission, Sharing and Caring (food bank) and then we take needy families shopping for food, clothes and a few toys for the kids. We did about 17 families
FL Jupiter (and Miller's Ale House (35 Locations) After the law took effect July 1, 2003, the Ale House chain experienced the first decline in business in its 15-year history, said Dave Reid, vice president for operations. ...For the first five months of 2004 alcoholic beverages sales were down $2 million compared with January through May of 2003"
FL Lake Wales Cherry Pocket Restraunt 30% 30% Small business work so hard for their business, it is hard to believe the Goverment can just take it away without any thought at all.
FL Naples The Falls Restaurant Closed 100% 100% "We lost 70 percent of our income," Renzello said. "The law put us out of business." 90 percent of her customers were smokers.
FL New Port Richey Gulf Harbor Yacht Club Private Club 68%
FL North Fort Jerseys Sports Cafe Sports Bar 25% 20% / 4 Whatever happened to the individuals freedom to choose where you go and what you do in public?
FL Pensacola Beach Elks #2256 (Private Club) Lodge Private Club 20% 30% "We've lost 70 members because of the ban"
FL Plantation Elks #2273 (Private Club) Lodge Private Club 60% 60% / 1
FL Port Charlotte Melons Bar & Grill Bar/Restaurant Closed 100% 100% / 4 Before closing they experienced a 50% loss in sales and a 60% loss in tips becuase of the smoking ban.
FL St.James City Double Nichol Pub Tavern 10% 10% / 3
FL Tampa Toucans Bar & Grill 30-40% 50% / 3
FL Thonotosas Grandma's Kitchen Restaurant Closed 100% 100% / 5
FL Venice Bogey's Restaurant/Sports Pub >20%
FL West Palm Beach Zook's "It has almost put me out of business. We are down about 45 percent for each month," Zook said. "Our food sales were 48 percent of our business. Now they are down to 10 percent. A lot of people who had drinks with lunch or dinner are not coming in now. They can't eat here."
FL Wildwood Buddy's BBQ Restaurant Closed 100% 100%
GA State Huddle House Restaurant 75% Within the week those who meet there on a regular basis to drink coffee, smoke, converse and yes to eat have reduced by 75%.
IL Skokie Village Inn Sports Bar 37% 6
IRELAND Assorted 200 pubs pubs Closed 100% 100% The Vintners Federation of Ireland told an Oireachtas committee yesterday that 7,600 jobs had been lost in the hospitality industry since the ban’s introduction, while 200 pubs had also closed down.
IRELAND Dublin Bewley's Oriental Cafe Tea and Coffee Shop Closed 100% 100% The shop, located on Westmoreland St, had been in business since 1986
IRELAND Dublin Bewley's Oriental Cafe Tea and Coffee Shop Closed 100% 100% The Grafton Street Shop had been open since 1927.
IRELAND Dublin MacTurcails 20%
IRELAND Eyre Square Fibber Magees Closed 100% 100% ``We're damned if we do and damned if we don't,'' Lawless said {Defying the law}. ``We're either going to go out of business or be put out of business.'' Before closing the bar suffered loses of 66%
KS Lawrence Hereford House 40% 16
KS Lawrence The Meat Market Bar/ Restaurant Closed 100% 100%
KY Lexington Friends and Company Bar/Restaraunt 30% The restaurant has experienced the lowest revenue in the last 19 months.
KY Lexington Lynagh's Pub Bar/Restruant 40% "Smokers still come, but not as often and they don't stay as long. "
KY Lexington Maxwell's Tavern Closed 100% 100% Maxwells had been open for 14 years.
KY Lexington Nicholson's Cigar Bar Cigar Bar 100% 100% Owners of Nicholson's Cigar Bar say it didn't make sense to operate a smoke-less cigar bar
KY Tatets Creek Jackpot Bingo 50% The Tates Creek High School Marching Band stands to lose about $80,000 this year in bingo money.
MA Bradford Pockets Billiards Pool Hall 100% 100% Closed after 11 years!
MA Cambridge Bud's Place 23% 500%
MA Chicopee Falls Blue Room Cafe Tavern 25% The business has been open since 1936
MA Fall River Gold Mine Restaraunt Bar/Restaraunt 50% 50% / 2 "There should be places for both the smoker and nonsmoker. I do not smoke but you are killing our business!!! "
MA Hingham Aloha Tavern Closed 100% 100%
MA Marlboro Marlboro Cozy Cafe 60% 2 We had 5 employees, now have 3 and that includes me. If this is result of one month of the ban after 35yrs in business I may have to close my doors.
MA South Weymouth J.C. Grear’s Tavern Closed 100% 100% "Decimated after the ban."
MA South Weymouth J.C. Grear's Restaurant Closed 100% 100%
MA Springfield Blarney Stone Tavern 25%
MA Springfield City Line Cafe Tavern 50% "People are complaining about it. They're saying 'Why go out for a drink when I can buy a six-pack and sit at home?' It's really hurting us."
MA Weymouth Various Places 50% Owners told the Town Council ” Business is down 50 percent since the ban went into effect.
MD Bethesda Uncle Jed's Roadhouse Tavern 50% 70% / 2 ...Smaller establishments have seen total sales decline by an average of 30 percent during the week and 50 percent on weekends, according to Melvin Thompson, vice president of the Restaurant Association of Maryland
MD Gaithersburg Anchor Inn restaurant Closed 100% 100% Since the ban was implemented October 2003 Anchor Inn suffered a 40 percent loss in Keno, beer, wine, liquor and food sales.
MD Gaithersburg Buffalo Billiards Pool Hall 50%
MD Gaithersburg Buffalo Wings and Beer Bar/Restaurant 50%
MD Gaithersburg Gentleman Jim's Restaurant 40%
MD Gaithersburg J.J. Muldoon's Bar/Restaurant 20%
MD Gaithersburg Mrs. O'Leary's Restaurant and Pub 50%
MD Germantown Middlebrook Restaurant and Lounge Bar/Restaurant 50% "I'm so bitter today because I have worked too hard to keep this business going. It's just not fair."
MD Germantown Pelican Pete's Restaurant 60%
MD Olney Grand Marquis Caf‚ 30%
MD Olney Stained Glass Pub Tavern 30%
MD Poolesville Potomac Valley Lodge Lodge 17% 75% / 4 "I think in the future we'll have to close in the winter. We'll lay everyone off, let them collect unemployment for a few months and bring them back. They'd make more on unemployment."
MD Potomac Normandie Farm's Bar/Restruant 50% 2
MD Rockville Mark Timmons Tavern 20%
MD Rockville Silver Fountain Restaurant Restaurant 33%
MD Silver Spring Corner Pub Tavern 40%
MD Silver Spring Dietle's Tavern Tavern Closed 100%
MD Silver Spring Quarry House Tavern 70% New customers who come to the bar because it's smoke-free don't bring in the revenue that smokers did, she said. "They have one beer, a glass of water and something to eat," she said, whereas smokers tend to stay longer and eat and drink more alcohol.
ME Biddeford Nutshell Tavern Tavern Closed 100% 100%
ME Fryeburg Village Variety Closed 100%
ME Houlton Black Duck Lounge Tavern 70% "I've never seen it like this before. It's like all the customers just disappeared."
ME Rockland Waterworks Restaurant 50%
ME Waterville John Martin's Restaurant 25%
MN Bloomington Bloomington Park Tavern Tavern Closed 100%
MN Cloquet Grandma's Restaraunt 33%
MN Crystal VFW donations 46% Money lost to the smoking ban, she said, is money lost for local charities.
MN Duluth Perkins Restaraunt 26%
MN Long Lake Larry's Lounge Tavern Closed 100%

jamison

12-01-2006, 12:28 PM

MN Mall of America Jillians hi-Life Lanes, Player's Bar & Grill, America's Original Sports Bar Closed 100% The smoking ban hurt all of us a lot more than we thought it would, said Andy Kostka, manager of the Hooters restaurant in the mall.
MN Mankato Embers Restaurant Closed 100% Cole talked about his decision stoically. His wife, Nicole, was less reserved. She couldn’t fight back tears while talking about how much she’s going to miss her co-workers and customers.
MN Minneapolis Breakaway Luke asks you to please come in!
MN Minneapolis Dusty's Bar Bar 40% People don't want to be outside. So, they don't come... You talk to the night staff and they feel a bigger crunch than I do. They're not happy at all." To help make up for lost business, Dusty's, like many other establishments in Minneapolis, has added outdoor patios where customers can smoke.
MN Minneapolis Gabby's Restaurant 26% 10 Owner Jeffrey Ormond is in second legal challenge. Ormond co-founded the Minneapolis Hospitality Association, a group of more than 60 bars and restaurants in Hennepin’s largest city.
MN Minneapolis Lion's Club Private Club 25% Michael Kuduk says the lost business is hurting charitable gambling as well.
MN Minneapolis Molly Quinn's Closed 100% Lamphear says in fact, trouble began for him the first day the law went into effect.
MN Minneapolis Porters Closed 100%
MN Osseo Duffy's Bar and Grill Bar 35% Duffy told the board that Anoka County, with its restriction-free smoking, is a welcoming sight to his customers and only five minutes away.
MN St. Cloud GW Coffee and Tobacco 50% Will likely close its East Side shop in October, around the business' 12th anniversary, owner Marilyn Held said.
MN list online Closed 100% 2,500 jobs 97 more places now listed as closed
MN Tobacco City Tobacco Shop Closed 100%
ND Moorehead Vic's Lounge 40% “I used to have a nice family crowd, and now I don’t anymore,” Fergen said.
ND West Fargo VFW Private Club 40%
NE Lincoln 25 separate Bars and Grills 27% Desperate for customers, downtown bars have begun discounting alcohol.
NE Lincoln Big John Billards Billiards Closed 100% 100% Anderson said Big John's is not for sale and is not available for lease. She said it would reopen if the smoking ban is overturned.
NE Lincoln Cheerleaders Bar & Grill Bar/Grill 30% "I will be very lucky to survive over the summer," Borgmann said.
New Zealand Dannevirke Masonic Hotel Closed 100% The smoking ban has devastated the lives of Mark and Raewyn Payne, owners of the Masonic, a business they took over two years ago. In the period prior to the ban, they had a thriving business, with two full-time and three part-time employees.
New Zealand Foxton Post Office Hotel Restaurant 66% New Zealand hotel has smoking bus out front
New Zealand Napier BAT Factory Closed 100% 170 jobs Napier Mayor Barbara Arnott said the loss of so many jobs would be difficult for any city to manage.
New Zealand Rotorua Lake House Hotel 50% Ian Frith and Teresa Scally’s story confirms the smoking ban in bars has struck hard upon some hotel owners and licensees, and is placing businesses in jeopardy.
NY Albany Blessed Sacrament Church Bingo Hall 50%
NY Albany Temple Israel Bingo Hall 50% According to Herb Holland, some of the regulars told volunteers that they would abstain from playing bingo, to protest the smoking ban. He hasn't seen them since.
NY Astoria Athens Cafe Restaurant 55% 10
NY Auburn Kim's Trackside Tavern Tavern 25% 25% Our local cayuga county health dept. continues to refuse to issue smoking waivers to businesses who have suffered a financial hardship.
NY Bath Hotel McDonald Hotel 70%
NY Bath Just One More Tavern 30%
NY Bellerose Finish Line Bar/Restaurant 40% 2
NY Binghamton Airport Inn Tavern 40% Evans says business has dropped at least 40-percent in the last year. Her liquor license expires next April, and she says, she doesn't plan on renewing it. The Airport Inn was a successful business for 18 years.
NY Binghamton Edigan's Restaurant Closed 100% 100%
NY Binghamton Mama Lena's Restaurant Closed 100% 100% Mama Lena's had been in business for more than 40 years.
NY Binghamton Yesterday's Restaurant & Lounge Closed 100% 100% Mike and Suzanne Gavazzi closed after 18 years.
NY Brewster The Roadhouse Tavern 40%
NY Broadalbin The Lodge at the Lake Inc Bar/Restaurant 50% 1
NY Bronx Fieldstone Recreation Billiard/Bar/Snacks 40% 1
NY Buffalo American Legion Post 1041 Bingo Hall 68%
NY Buffalo Amherst Bowling Center Bowling Alley Closed 100%
NY Buffalo B&G Bar and Grill Bar/Restaurant 30%
NY Buffalo Cabaret Tavern 40% 1
NY Buffalo Cook Bar & Grill Bar/Restaurant 40% 2
NY Buffalo Freddies Bar/Restaurant 50%
NY Buffalo Pocketeer Billiards Pool Hall 60-70% "The President says small business is the backbone of our country, NYS says screw small business just give us your money and your blood! All of it!!!!!!
NY Buffalo Susie's Corner Bar/Restaurant 23% 1
NY Buffalo The Royal Pheasant Restaurant Closed 100% 100% / 20 The smoking ban caused an instant 80 percent decrease in revenue. The Royal Phesant had been a family business for 58 years.
NY Buffalo Voelker Bowling Center Bowling Alley 30-40% The smoking ban hit us like an anvil, curtailing bowling activity by 30 to 40 percent and the bar business by 20 to 30 percent.
NY Camden Harter's Bar/Restaurant 40%
NY Camden Liberty Lanes Bowling 27%
NY Canandaigua Canandaigua Billiards Pool Hall 40%
NY Champlain Stumble Inn Tavern Closed 100% 100%
NY Cheektowaga Metropolitan Restaurant Bar/Restaurant 25% 2
NY Cheektowaga Peter K's Bar/Restaurant 35% 2
NY Chestnut Ridge Silo's Bar & Grill 35%
NY Cicero Damon's Party House Tavern 40%
NY Clay Richard's Ole Timer Bar/Restaurant 17% 1
NY Cold Brook Clifford's Tavern Bar/Restaurant 40%
NY Corfu Dadio's Central Tavern 30%

jamison

12-01-2006, 12:29 PM

NY Cortland Argyle's EasyStreet Tavern Tavern 12%
NY Cotati Friar Tuck's Restaurant 50% "Just as my establishment was beginning to flourish, I'm hit with this smoking ban which has killed my daytime business. People who used to stay for a couple of hours now only stay for one quick drink and leave."
NY Delhi Blinkey's Tavern Closed 100% 100%
NY East Randolph VFW Post 6533 Private Club 20% 25%
NY Elmira Heights American Legion Private Club 60% 50%
NY Elmira Heights Blondie's Tavern Tavern 25%
NY Endicott O's Place Tavern Closed 100% 100%
NY Endwell O's Place Closed 100% 100%
NY Falconer Chances Tavern Closed 100% 100%
NY Falconer Mel's Place Tavern 78% 100% After proving they had lost significant business, Mel's place was granted of the NY's few waivers. Their business immediately returned to the pre ban level, but the owners are worried about what will happen when the waiver runs out in a year.
NY Fredonia Barker Brew Pub Brew Pub Closed 100% 100% Closed after 10 yrs. in business
NY Frewsburg The Loft Tavern 30% "Our town has no attractions to draw in outsiders. We have only locals to rely on as patrons and 95% of them smoke. It will be worse when the snow sets in."
NY Fulton Fulton Ale House Tavern 75% Owner Joe Mancino may have to give up his business of 35 years.
NY Goshen The Wonderbar Tavern 50%
NY Hyde Park KayCey's Tavern 45%
NY Ithica Bowl-O-Drome Bowling Alley 14% 2 TThe business lost almost $30,000 and 110 bowlers during the 32-week league season... In the bowling alley's busiest months between January and May, Parkin saw a 14 percent decrease in activity comparing the same period in 2004 to 2003.
NY Jackson Heights La Bataclana Tavern Closed 100% 100%
NY Jamestown Coin Operated Amusements Vending Machines 20-50% Revenue from vending machines and games cut in half in many places.
NY Jamestown Elks Lodge (Private Club) Private Club Closed 100% Bingo, which funded their charitable work, is now completely shut down.
NY Jamestown Fountain Bowl Bowling Alley 40% N/A / 8
NY Jamestown Mr. D's Bar/Restaurant Closed 100% 100%
NY Jamestown Patsy's Lounge Tavern 50% / 2 "I have let 2 employees go and the other 3 have had their hours cut in half."
NY Jamestown Tommy's Place Bar/Restaurant Closed 100% 100%
NY Jamestown Windsor Ale House Tavern Closed 100% 100%
NY Johnstown Partner's Pub Bar/Restaurant 20% 1
NY Kennedy Crossroads Steak House Restaurant Closed 100% 100%
NY Lake George Lemon Peel Lounge 20% 2 "The ban has hurt, we now open later and close early."
NY Lakewood Ye Olde Anchor Inn Bar/Restaurant 18% 22%
NY Liverpool End Zone Bar/Restaurant 30% 1
NY Lockawanna, Woody's Pub Bar/Restaurant 25% 3
NY Long Island Olympian Sumont Inc Pool Hall/Bar/Rest 40% 3
NY Malone Knights of Columbus Bingo Hall 80%
NY Malone Seven's Bar Tavern 30%
NY Marcellus Village Tavern Bar/Restaurant 10%
NY Marcy Riverside Lanes Bowling 20% 2
NY Massena Delmar Sportsman's Tavern Tavern 30% 1 "We had hoped...nonsmokers who haven't been frequenting taverns due to the smoke-filled air would make up for at least some of the financial loss. Unfortunately, at least in our place, this has most definitely not happened. Our sales are at an all time low"
NY Massena Open Net Lounge Tavern 11%
NY Mattydale The Cam-Nel Tavern Closed 100% 100% The Cam-Nel had been in operation since 1952
NY Mayville Lakeview Hotel/Blues Rock Cafe Tavern 50% 50% On the first day of the ban, my tips and number of customers dropped 50%, and never came back up.
NY Middleport Middleport Inn Bar/Restaurant Closed 100% 100% / 13 "This damn state really knows how to kill people's dreams."
NY Middletown Whispers Cocktail Lounge Bar/Night Club 50% 90%
NY Monroe Brazen Head Pub Tavern 40%
NY Mt. Morrison Mills Race Restaurant Bar/Restaurant 40% 2.5
NY New Rochelle Dudley's Parkview Tavern Tavern 45% "From last summer to this summer, coming into this season, business is off by at least 45 percent. ... The bar is empty."
NY New York Aessa Bar/Restaurant 35% 6
NY New York Blarney Stone Bar/Restaurant 15% 1
NY New York Caffe on the Green Bar/Restaraunt 35% Bar business fell about 35 percent immediately after the ban. It has picked up since he added a "butt hut," an outdoor tent where patrons may smoke, but it's still less than before the ban.
NY New York Castle Heights Tavern Closed 100% 100%
NY New York Elbo Room Tavern Closed 100% 100%
NY New York Euzkadi Restaurant 50%
NY New York Fiddler's Green Tavern Closed 100% 100% We have just lost too many customers to this law, which I did not vote for, bar owners did not vote for, bartenders did not vote for, and the public did not vote for."
NY New York Harry's Hanover Square Bar/Restaraunt Closed 100% 100 "Overnight, we lost 60 percent of our evening bar trade. For the bar, it was the difference in profit and loss. Sales of expensive cigars had been almost as important as the sales of Scotch" Harry's had been in business for more than thirty years
NY New York Le Bar Bat Tavern Closed 100% 100%
NY New York Madame X Tavern 50%
NY New York Manhattan Beer Distributors Vendor 19% Stagnant sales have led to a 7% drop in beer demand citywide, and a 19% drop citywide to clubs.
NY New York Millennium Restaurant 40% 3
NY New York Nocturne Nightclub Closed 100% 100% / 70
NY New York O'Neill's Tavern 20% 3 "People who don't go to pubs just don't go to pubs. They said the ban would be good for business and for employees, yet my business is down and three good staff are out of work and unable to find another job...Most of my staff are smokers, and now they're being protected from second-hand smoke."
NY New York Pangaea Tavern Closed 100% 100%
NY New York Roesch's Tavern Closed 100% 100% Lauterborn, 60, said his bar, Roesch's in Queens, saw 40 customers nightly before the ban but only about five after it. He closed in September and says his children are supporting him while he looks for work. His tavern had been a 100 year old family owned business.
NY New York Slade Restaurant 40%
NY New York Sugoba Bistro Bistro Closed 100% 100% / 28 After 8 years of success in NYC, the NY smoking ban killed my Bistro in less than a year! In less than 3 month my business declined 37%. Within six months I was unable to meet payroll and I had to lay off 28 employees.
NY New York Swan's Tavern Closed 100% 100% / 7 "I felt bad laying off seven workers. Most of them had been with me for the five years Swan's was open. None of them had ever complained about secondhand smoke. "
NY New York Swift's Tavern 40% "It's absolutely killed us. This time last year the bar would be packed with the after-work cocktail crowd. Now they just take a bottle of wine or a six-pack to each other's apartments, where they can smoke."
NY New York Whiskey Ward Tavern 20% 2
NY Newburgh Golden Rail Ale House Tavern 25%
NY Niagara Falls The Press Box Tavern Closed 100% 100% The Press Box had been open for 45 years.
NY Ogdensburg The Web Tavern Closed 100% 100% Owners Janet and Anthony Doerr say the smoking ban destroyed their business.
NY Oneida Bec's Ivy Grill Bar & Grill 23% 3
NY Oneida Five Corners Bar/Restaurant 32% After 20 years of hard work this is what NY state does to us. Where are all these nonsmokers?
NY Oswego Buoy's Dockside Tavern Tavern 36.50%
NY Oswego Eagle Beverage Company Distributor 25% N/A "Deliveries to pubs and taverns have decreased substantially, greater than 25 percent."
NY Oswego Shamrock Tavern Tavern 50% "It's not right. Our livelihood is being taken away."
NY Parkville Champions Billiards Cafe Brew Pub/Pool Hall 33%
NY Port Leyden Central Hotel Bar/Restaurant 50%
NY Portville Maple Tree Inn Tavern Closed 100% 100% / 3
NY Potsdam Roy D Graves VFW Post 1194 Tavern 22%
NY Potville Cork and Bottle Tavern Closed 100% 100% Located near the PA border, this was literally a Mom and Pop business, run by a couple with no employees to "protect."
NY Queens Bingo Halls Bingo Halls 50% "If they want to spend their money, they want to be comfortable," said Susan Shkoditch, the volunteer who runs the bingo games for the charities. "They're mostly angry that their rights are being violated."
NY Remsen Taylor's Trackside Bar/Restaurant 50%
NY Rochester Christanis Bar and Grill Tavern 40%
NY Rochester Hancock's Hudson Tavern Bar/Restaurant 15%
NY Rochester Panorama Sports Bar/Night Club 50% 50% / 4 We are a small night club that was doing very well until the smoking ban hit us and it hit us very hard. We are very scared of our future, if any .
NY Rochester Salingers Tavern 35% 2
NY Rochester The Loop Lounge Bar and restaurant 30% I own a small local tavern and I have a 90% smoking cliental. Let me say it just sucks.
NY Rome Sammy G's Bar/Restaurant 50%
NY Sanborn Walmore Inn Restaurant/ Tavern Thank you for fighting the smoking ban.
NY Savannah D&S Diner Restaurant Closed 100% 100% Sales were down $3,000 in July 2002 compared to July 2001. Hardest hit were on Friday nights and Sunday mornings.
NY Scottsville Chili American Legion Post 1830 Private Club 70%
NY Sloan Unique Lounge Bar/Restaurant 40% 4
NY South Dayton, Rough Kutts Tavern Tavern 21% 1
NY Southport George & Shirl's Tiny Tavern Tavern 41% In October 2002, the bar made $6,000. This past October, after the ban went into effect, they made just $3,500,

jamison

12-01-2006, 12:30 PM

NY Springville Pocketeer Billiards South Pool Hall Closed 100% From the Owner: "Pocketeer Billiards South is now officially closed due to the Hitler like laws the NYS. Politicians have enacted! NY continues in its efforts to drive business out to other states. I like many others have now chosen to leave after living here 58 years."
NY Staten Island Sharkey's Sports Bar and Grill Sports Bar 60%
NY Steamburg Coldspring Volunteer Fire Dept. Tavern 50% 75% / 1 The fire department owns the bar. Money from the bar buys equipment for the fire department. The income has been cut in half. This money buys new ambulances, trucks, gear ect. Remember, this all volunteer. Without the bar money we are going to have to rely on the town for revenue. You may lose your house or even someone's life without the money for the equipment.
NY Suffern Ireland's 32 Tavern 50%
NY Sunnyside Caseys Pub Tavern 35% 1
NY Syracuse Barrie's Tavern Tavern 40%
NY Syracuse Coleman's Irish Pub Bar/Restaurant 19% 4
NY Syracuse Doc's little Gem Diner 27% 10 "We fought tooth and nail and won a local County victory, only for the state to turn it over to a complete ban."
NY Syracuse Dodesters Tavern 20% "My business is down 20% from the same period last year, even though I'm now open three more hours a day and I didn't have a kitchen then."
NY Syracuse Nibsy's Pub Bar/Restaurant 18%
NY Syracuse Rafferty's Bar/Restaurant 35% 2
NY Syracuse Syracuse Brigadiers Bingo Hall 61% "The hall was losing about $60,000 per month in net income for the past three months because of the smoking ban."
NY Syracuse Thompson Road Tavern Bar/Restaurant 25%
NY Syracuse Tommys Park Place Tavern 40%
NY Syracuse Viva Debris Comedy & Magic Club 30 30%
NY Tonawanda Slick Willie's Pool Hall 25%
NY Troy Celtic Cultural Organization Bingo Hall 30-35% "From July 25 through Nov. 1, we are down about $12,000 from the same period last year."
NY Troy Holmes & Watson's Tavern 30%
NY Utica The Dog House Bar/Restaurant 28%
NY Utica Varick Restaurant Inc Bar/Restaurant 35%
NY Utica, Shorty's Sports Bar & Grill Bar/Restaurant 30%
NY Wallkill Desperado's Tavern 90% "I can count on my fingers the people who don't smoke who come in here. The regulars say they won't come."
NY Watertown Brown Shanty Tavern 20% 1
NY Wellsburg Village Tavern 50%
NY West Seneca Southgate Lanes Bowling Alley/Bar 55% 7
NY Wheatfield The Alps Restaurant Closed 100% 100%
NY Wheatfield The Meeting Place Restruant/Tavern Closed 100% 100%
NY Wilson Jean's Bar & Grill Tavern 26%
NY Binghamton Mama Lena's Italian American Restaurant Closed 100% 100%
NY Binghamton Valentine's Neighborhood Tavern & Grill Closed 100% 100%
NY Buffalo Jimmy Mac's Bar & Grill Closed 100% 100% "We are out of business, laid off 35 employees..... We went from making a steady living for 24 years to losing about $100,000. per year compliments of the smoking ban. The government figures are lies. Tell your friends who own bars that if the ban goes in they might as well pack up and leave." - Rick Naylon
NY Holland Holland Hotel Bar/Restaurant 45% My wife and three children (8, 4 & 2) have used all of our savings to supplement the business after the ban." - Mark Mazurek, Owner
OH Centerville Bill's Donuts Donut shop 20%
OH Centerville Cork and Bottle Carryout Lunch counter 25%
OH Centerville Thirsty Dog Grille & Brewery Closed 100% General manager, Bill Burns: A direct result of the city's smoking ban that went into effect April 4
OH Columbus Ann and Mike's Main St. Tavern Tavern 50% "This is all my husband and I do for a living. This is it," she says. Saying the smoking ban is destroying her profits. "I rang $37 on a Tuesday. That's from 10am to 230am," Leslie said. "I've cut all my vendors in half."
OH Columbus Coin-Op Vending Vending 15% Cigarette sales are down 50%. They report the bars outside of the Columbus ban are doing record business.
OH Columbus Fitzwillys Bar Judy Browning, owner, said she is losing customers to private clubs, such as the Moose and Elks, which already are exempt from the policy. "As long as cigarettes are legal, please allow the freedom of choice," she pleaded. "As much as the loss of income affects us, it will affect city and state revenue, too."
OH Columbus Julian's Restaurant/Bar Closed 100% Owner Julian Sanfillipo says the smoking ban is to blame for the decline, and eventual death of his business.
OH Columbus Kacys Sports Bar & Grille Tavern 50% "Kacy's Sports Bar and Grill has room for 300 customers, but now, it's virtually empty."
OH Columbus Maximillions Closed 100% "We closed the doors on July 22, 2005."
OH Columbus Mulligan's Sports Pub Bar 50% They were the first business charged with violating the ban.
OH Columbus Sinbad's Show Bar 90% "I don't know what to do, we've been in business for 15 years." Ron Polster, owner, said he has been losing both customers and employees to taverns in Reynoldsburg and Gahanna, which do not have indoor smoking policies.
OH Columbus Somewhere Else Tavern 3 "I feel bad. I've let three bartenders go," Tim Cashin says. "I'm seeing revenue loss of $1200-$1500 a week."
OH Columbus Sycamore Café Tavern Closing 100% 100% "After 42 years, the citywide smoking ban, in effect, will result in the closure of our establishment." Ron and Marilyn Stone.
OH Columbus Varsity Club Rest/ Bar Has lost business, especially during happy hours -when about half of the patrons used to smoke -said manager Laurie Watkins.

jamison

12-01-2006, 12:30 PM

OH Columbus WK Vending Vending 15-25% We supply to neighborhood taverns everything for coin operated amusements, says Fowler. "Our bottom line is actually starting to drop."
OH Toledo Adam's Place Tavern Closed 100% 100%
OH Toledo Arnie's Eating & Drinking Saloon Restaurant/ Bar Arnie Elzey was one of the main proponents of a successful effort to modify Toledo's smoking ban.
OH Toledo Bait Shop Bar & Grill Closed 100% 100%
OH Toledo Blue Jeans Tavern Closed 100% 100%
OH Toledo Consaul Tavern Tavern Closed 100% 100% Consaul Tavern had been in business over 53 years.
OH Toledo East Broadway Nightclub Nightclub 50% "From the get-go I've lost business. I've lost 50 percent -- everybody's losing money."
OH Toledo East Broadway Nite Club Night Club Closed 100% 100%
OH Toledo Elbo Room Pizza Parlor/Tavern 25% 2
OH Toledo End Zone Electronics Tavern Closed 100% 100%
OH Toledo Fat Tuesdays Tavern Closed 100% 100%
OH Toledo Jordan's Place Tavern Closed 100% 100%
OH Toledo Laskey Lounge Tavern Closed 100% 100%
OH Toledo Max's Diners (2 locations) Restaurant Closed 100% 100% The Kaminskis say they tried to contact the city several times last year to see if they could get some help.
OH Toledo Ottawa Lanes Bowling Closed 100% 100% “He was so drastically impacted by the smoking ban in Toledo.”
OH Toledo Prime Time South Night Club Closed 100% 100%
OH Toledo Rack Time Billiards Pool Hall Closed 100% 100%
OH Toledo Ragtime Ricks Tavern Closed 100% 100%
OH Toledo Rooster Inn Brew Pub Closed 100% 100%
OH Toledo Shamrocks Tavern Closed 100% 100%
OH Toledo The "In" Zone Tavern Closed 100% 100%
OH Worthington Kacy's Sports Bar 50% "Kacy's Sports Bar and Grill has room for 300 customers, but now, it's virtually empty."
OR Corvallis The Peacock Bar/Restaraunt 40% Connor owned the Peacock for years - and says it was the ban that caused him to sell the bar. He says business gross fell from $1.5 million in 1997, the year before the ban went into effect, to $900,000 last year.
OR Corvallis The Peacock (New Owner) Bar/Restaraunt 50% 36
OR Eugene Bliss' Steak Ranch Restaurant Closed 100% 100% Closed after 32 years in business
OR Eugene Doc's Pad Tavern Closed 100% 100% / 24 "Let's face it, the economy is horrible. But for us specifically, the smoking ban was the knockout punch." The Olsen family had owned Doc's for 16 years.
OR Eugene Max's Tavern Tavern Closed 100% 100%
Scotland Fun Pub Pub Closed 100% 100% Billy Laing said he would have to look at cuts after a "drastic" reduction in takings.
Sweden Country Svenska Spel State Owned Gaming 2% Ban hits Svenska Spel's profits
TX Coppera's Cove Grant's Bar and Grill Uptown Cafe Closed 100% 100%
TX Corpus Christi Katz 21, P.O.E.T.S, Q Pub Taverns 36% All plaintiffs in a lawsuit against the city of Corpus Christi. They asked a federal judge to temporarily suspend the ban, partially because of lost revenues.
TX Dallas Matt's No Place Restaurant Closed 100% 100% Business simply dried up, restaurateur Matt Martinez said, after the City Council enacted a smoking ban in restaurants and other public places. "I just got fed up," said Martinez, "You work to get a clientele and build your business, and then the city comes and takes it from you."
TX Round Rock China One Restaurant Closed 100% 100%
TX San Antonio Good Time Charlie's Restaurant 30%
TX Victoria Ramsey's Restaurant Restaurant 25% Reaves said the city's timing on enacting the ban was not good. "They should have waited until after the holidays," he said. "This will kill the restaurant industry."
UK Congleton George Pub 35% Landlady Lynn O'Connell stubbed out the ban after the losses. The award she'd been given by Congleton's Mayor Baxendale was then taken away by a council environmental officer.
WA Bellingham Horseshoe 12%
WA Bellingham Waterfront Restaurant 9%
WA Clarkston Hogans 30%
WA Clarkston Hogan's Restaurant 30% Owner Tony Salerno says customers tell him bluntly they are going to Idaho bars, where smoking is still legal.
WA Clarkston Smitty’s Barrel 60% 4
WA Clarkston Smitty's Barrell 60%
WA Everett White Elephant Bar & Grill Inc. Restaurant 75% 2 We are a 54 year old business and we are going broke over the new law forced upon us business owners in Washington state.
WA Kent Inn Between Tavern 40%
WA Okanogan The Club 29%
WA Olympia The Spar 30%
WA Oroville Yo Yo's Restaurant 16%
WA Pullman Munchy'z 30%
WA Republic Madonna's Bar & Grill 13%
WA Seattle Gim Wah 35% Nena Tyson says restaurant hurt too.
WA Seattle Highlander Tavern Tavern 30% Patty Hutchison says her outdoor tent was taken away too.
WA Seattle Mecca Cafe 40%
WA Seattle Mickey's Bar & eatery 35%
WA Seatttle Tini Bigs 17%
WA Teninio Powder Keg 27%
WA Tonasket Tonasket Saloon 25%
WA Wenatchee Trav's Restaurant 30%
WA White Salmon The Elkhorn Bar & Grill 18%
WI Appleton Various Places 65% "After only one month with a ban."
WI Madison Ole 'N Rick's North Side Inn Closed 100% Terry Olson, co-owner of Ole 'N Rick's North Side Inn in Madison, said business is down 60 percent and he started cutting back shifts for three or four bartenders Monday.Owner Terry Adkins warned the City Council this would happen
WI Madison Tip Top Tavern Tavern It's terrible, absolutely terrible, said Cal Beecher, owner of the Tip Top Tavern. "I've been here 32 years. It's going to close me down."
WI Madison VFW Canteen Tavern Closed 100% Saying its clientele had mostly vanished into clean air.
WI Madison Wiggie's 30% Dave Wiganowsky, "By implementing this ban, the city has kicked the spokes out of my wheel that I had spinning very nicely for 25 years."
WI Wausau Diamond Dave's Restaurant Closed 100% Owner Steve Frazier blames the ban.
WV Charleston Mulligan's Restaurant/Bar Closed 100% 100% David Reynolds said that staff members "went to work Tuesday and they were closed.”
WV Huntington Calamity Café Restaurant Closed 100% 100% The restaurant cited the smoking ban as hurting business and a reason to close.

2smart4u

12-01-2006, 12:52 PM

A bunch of crap.

What a difficult-to-read post. You need to learn how to copy and paste correctly.

Canada? Who cares? A whole different country.

I bet for each place that closed or had lower sales, just as many more did much better business. Many of the closed places were probably about ready to close anyway. Bowling alleys are closing all over the country. They take up too much valuable real estate for what they bring in. I always avoided them because of all the smoking.

And are we as a society really worse off for bars closing and less alcohol being sold? I think not.

People are losing jobs in all sectors. As they say, "It's the economy, stupid".

2smart4u

12-01-2006, 12:53 PM

And your source is...?

jamison

12-01-2006, 01:07 PM

What a difficult-to-read post. You need to learn how to copy and paste correctly.

Canada? Who cares? A whole different country.

I bet for each place that closed or had lower sales, just as many more did much better business. Many of the closed places were probably about ready to close anyway. Bowling alleys are closing all over the country. They take up too much valuable real estate for what they bring in. I always avoided them because of all the smoking.

And are we as a society really worse off for bars closing and less alcohol being sold? I think not.

People are losing jobs in all sectors. As they say, "It's the economy, stupid".

Just remember folks, this is the way all the so concerned and caring anti-smokers think.
Jamison

happysmoker

12-01-2006, 01:45 PM

But if I'm smoking in my car because of my own stupidity and addiction,

Smokers have to stop thinking of themselves as stupid or even addicted. You're not stupid! You probably have a <a href="http://www.forces.org/evidence/evid/therap.htm">therapeutic</a> need and found that smoking helps. Your body is telling you what you need! Unfortunately, in this day and age, we rely more on pharmaceutical ads and biased studies instead of listening to our own bodies. At the very least, smoking calms you and relieves stress.

Smoking is not "stupid" or "nasty" or any of the other disparaging things the antis say is it. We have to stop thinking in these terms if we are to change the group-think about smoking.

If you haven't already, think about switching to <a href="http://syo.dalrun.com/">stuffing your own</a>. Just like packaged food found in the supermarket, packaged cigarettes have fillers and additives. Pure tobacco, like whole food is better for you. Stuffing your own also costs less and you don't pay into the MSA where your money is distributed to anti-smoking groups to be used to harass and discriminate against you. Yes, our own tax money is being used AGAINST us!

And please read these two books, available to read online and as downloads:

<a href="http://www.lcolby.com">"In Defense of Smokers" by Lauren A. Colby</a>
<a href="http://legacy.library.ucsf.edu/cgi/getdoc?tid=isf14d00&fmt=pdf&ref=results">"The Smoking Scare De-Bunked" by Dr. William T. Whitby</a>

EVERY smoker should read these two books!

2smart4u

12-01-2006, 01:50 PM

Just remember folks, this is the way all the so concerned and caring anti-smokers think.
Jamison

That's right! And we outnumber you smokers.

2smart4u

12-01-2006, 01:54 PM

"Smokers have to stop thinking of themselves as stupid or even addicted. "

They are stupid AND addicted.

"At the very least, smoking calms you and relieves stress."

Actually, studies show that smoking can CAUSE stress.

"Smoking is not "stupid" or "nasty" or any of the other disparaging things the antis say is it."

Actually, it is both. You forgot "disgusting".

"Yes, our own tax money is being used AGAINST us!"

It's being used for the benefit of all.

And please don't waste your time reading those two books, which are just garbage, pushed by Big Tobacco and Big Anti-Fresh Air.

jamison

12-02-2006, 06:16 AM